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Mr. Biz Radio: How to Optimally Scale a Start-Up from the Founder of "Million Dollar Collar"

Unedited transcription of the show is included below:

(00:05):

Welcome to Mr. Biz radio, Biz. Talk for Biz owners. If you're ready to stop faking the funk and take your business onward and upward, this show is for you. And now here's Mr. Biz, Ken Wentworth.

(00:19):

All right. Welcome to another episode of Mr. Biz with me, Mr. Biz, Ken Wentworth, and our guest this week. First of all, is a rockstar entrepreneur. But second of all, I'm gonna give you a little clue. We're gonna talk about why showing you this super flimsy caller. So our guest this is not only Mr. Rob Kessler, he's the inventor and co-founder of Million Dollar Collar Shocker, right? Rob was the inventor a relatively simple solution for what his company, Placketities. I, I might be saying that wrong,  Placketities, I know what a plaque is, but I might be saying it wrong. Umhat's a sinking wrinkling unfolding of the plaque of a casually worn dress shirt prior to a Million Dollar Collar. Rob did screen printing in embroidery business from a spare bedroom in his house to over a million dollars in revenue before selling the company.

(01:09):

Although the company was never intended to be a screen printing company word soon, spread about the high quality, great pricing, and never missed a deadline guarantee. Rob's sales experience, a number of high dollar industries, including diamonds, real estate and automotive sales provided a unique blend of backgrounds. Transi transition him into the fashion world. His ability to look at the world through a different set of lenses that most people than most people led his to his success in every sales job and with both of his businesses. So we're gonna talk with Rob and he's gonna give us some tips later in the show about how to scale a startup business. So you're gonna want to hear that, but I want to hear this story. So Rob walk, first of all, welcome to Mr. Biz Radio. Thanks for joining

(01:47):

Us. Absolutely. How are you?

(01:49):

I'm fantastic, man. I'm look, I told you, I, I, I wore this call, this, this shirt with this collar on purpose, man. So, so, so before we get into a Million Dollar Collar, tell us about your entrepreneurial journey. What, what brought you here?

(02:01):

You know, I just remember being like 13 years old and cutting the grass, you know, my dad gave us chores when we were little and we'd get our allowance on like Sunday night. And one of the things that he did was give us the whole week's worth of lunch, food money that day also. So he goes, Hey man, if you wanna go party on Monday with all your buddies, you're gonna be starving on Friday. And, and he taught us budgeting when we were really young. I mean, I'm the oldest and I, my youngest was six years younger than me. So we were all getting our money at, you know, 8, 9, 10 years old for the whole week and trying to figure things out. But I oddly remember cutting grasses. You know, my dad only paid five bucks. My neighbor started paying 10 and 15. So, but I would be walking and doing my lines and thinking I'm gonna cut this grass so good that someone's gonna drive by and say, I want you to cut my grass. And I literally lived on like a dead end cul-de-sac basically. So there was never any traffic and nobody ever did it, but I always had that mentality of man. I'm just gonna do the best job I can. And, and I, I hope somebody notices.

(03:01):

Yeah. Well, it's funny you say that you know, even with I had the same experience cutting grass and all that kind of stuff. And then same exact mentality. My dad paid five bucks to cut the grass, even though I know he hated doing it, right? So I'm like, you gotta be kidding me. The replacement cost for this has gotta be worth more than five bucks. But I remember saying, saying to myself, I'm gonna cut this grass so well that my dad's gonna be so imp. I always thinking my dad would be impressed. They'd want me to cut it, cut, cut it. Or, or pay me more to cut it. And then when our kids got older, funny enough, you said your, your neighbors are paying more. My next door neighbor came over. Cuz our, our daughters started cutting the grass and he came over and his daughter was cutting the grass and our daughters are about the same age. And he was like, Hey what's the going rate? I wanna make sure they don't pit us against each other. So <laugh>

(03:48):

Yeah. I never tried to push my dad cause I knew, you know, I'm like dad, you're only paying five bucks. He goes, yeah. Do you like the roof over your head and the bed and all the food and the clothes on your back. So I didn't really have a much negotiating angle. So I just went after the new neighbors, new new customers.

(04:01):

Yeah, there you go. There you go. So, so from the grass cutting, where, where, where, where did that lead you?

(04:07):

So I played highly competitive soccer and other sports, but I got a job at this soccer in volleyball store. When I was a junior in high school and day one, the owner gave me a key to the store. He gave me a code to the alarm. He put all his trust and faith in me. I knew a couple of the other guys that worked there and he just made me feel like it was my business and I was freaking 17 years old. So I went in and I started, I would redecorate the store. I'd go up there with friends after work and we'd like tear everything down and reorganize the whole thing and just gave me all this freedom. I helped with orders. I was helping with finances in the business side. So I did that job for a few years. Almost dropped outta college cuz I thought, man, I'm making 14 grand a year. There's nothing gonna beat this. <Laugh> and thank God I didn't. I, I ended up graduating in four years, but I worked full time all the way through college, went to school full time, graduated in four years. So did that job. Then I got into real estate. I got into car sales, my dad owned jewelry store. So I sold jewelry and just did all kinds of sales jobs. Cause I always knew the harder I worked, the more money I could make. So I, I just appreciated that.

(05:09):

Well, it's interesting too is, and we've talked about on the show, we've been on the show for almost six years now, but a lot of people say I don't like sales. I don't wanna be a salesperson. First of all, if you know how to sell, you'll never be, you'll never starve, right? You'll never starve. Like you gotta. And every person on the face to earth is a salesperson. Whether you wanna admit it or not. And the silly example that I always give people and they go, no, no, no, that's not me. I'm an introvert. I don't sell. I'm a numbers. I'm an it person. Whatever. No, no. Do you have kids? Yes I do. Okay. do you have young kids? Well, yeah, I have a three year old. When you put green beans on your three year old's plate and they don't want to eat it, guess what you're doing, you're selling them on why to eat the stinking green beans. So you're selling when your wife says, Hey, I want to go to this restaurant and you don't want to go there. You're selling, you're selling her on why to go somewhere else. So whether you wanna believe it or not, everybody's a salesperson and the better you are at it, honestly the easier life's gonna be. And obviously you've been very successful with it. So have you ever thought about it from that perspective?

(06:11):

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, it's I'm a big Grant Cardone own fan and he talks about that a lot and kind of brought it to my attention as well. But you know, it's just, it's a relationship thing. I don't really look at it as selling when I start feeling like I'm pushing the sale. That's when I, I take, have to take a step back and say, look, this isn't make it about them, keep it about them. And, and usually things work out just fine.

(06:33):

Well, I I'm a Grant Cardone fan as well. I've done a bunch of things with him. He's actually, he's been on the show two or three times. Elena's been on the show a couple times. Brandon Dawson's been on the show. And, but that's one thing that I differ from him on that he is a push salesman. I'm a pool salesman similar to what you're saying and it's like, I'm not I'm I don't wanna push stuff on you. Like, I'll tell you what I got and I'm just not comfortable being so, you know, like that push angle of it.

(07:02):

Yeah. He's, he's aggressive for sure. And I think if you could take bits and pieces and make it your own you know, I think he comes from the, the confidence that he's built enough stuff for so long that you know, he, he knows that by not buying that you're, you're not getting the best thing. And I think that's a different level of sales to know that your product is so good that no matter what, as long as you have it, you're gonna be better off than not having it. And sometimes that's a gut check, you know?

(07:29):

Yeah. Well, I will say this much for him. While that, that push sometimes is like, it's a little, much, I've done a ton of stuff I've been to, I think four growth cons I've been to, I bought I'm part of Carter university. I've done mm-hmm <affirmative> I can't think of anything that I've ever bought from him that I was like, mm, this kind of sucked. It wasn't worth it. Like,

(07:49):

No, but trying to sell him. That's tough, man. I I've got these custom shirts that I'll show you later, but we did one, I ordered four of his pocket squares with his logo. Had the shirt made with those pieces, went, sent my partner down to the bootcamp just so he was face to face with them. And you know, we're still trying to get through the door and I've got Jared's number. I've got a bunch of their top sales guys numbers and you know, it, that's a tough nuts to crack to get through those, to those guys. They're easy to bring it in, but they don't, they don't take it very, very well.

(08:19):

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, yeah. We'll have to talk afterwards cuz I, I know some of those guys as well and if I know some folks you know, the, the Dave Robards and mm-hmm <affirmative> yeah, Dave Todd straw. And if, if I know some folks that you don't, I I'm happy to connect you with them cuz I'm actually, I'm gonna go back down there in about three, four weeks. I've been down there eight, nine times in the last year or so. So know some of those guys, but we are up against a break here again this week. We're talking Mr. Rob Kessler, you can find out more and we're gonna talk about it. I promise in the next segment, we're gonna talk about Million Dollar Collar, even like the milliondollarcollar.com. We'll come back, give the Mr. Biz tip of the week and continue learning from Mr. Kessler

(08:55):

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(09:40):

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(10:09):

Got a question for Mr. Biz. You want answered on air, email it to This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.. Now once again, here's Mr. Biz.

(10:21):

All right. Welcome back to the show. And as we always do at the top of the second segment is Mr. Biz tip of the week, which we also share on social media every week. So if you wanna catch him there, you can obviously follow us on all the social media platform. Mr. Biz, you'll find us. The Mr. Tip this week is if you cannot, you if you cannot see a measurable 300% return on your marketing spend, you either need to change your marketing plan. Or there I say, fire your marketer you should be able to three X, what you're spending on marketing. And I know a lot of people, especially like every time I share this tip, cuz we've shared it for a few years now. Cause I like it so much. Every time I mention this, when I speak all that stuff, I always get marketing.

(11:04):

People just blow me up. They're like, you're killing me, man. Like you can't get three X on everything. I'm like, well then you must not be very good at what you do because I know tons of marketers that can get three X on a spend and look, do you wanna work with a marketer who can, who's not that's the top of their game? Or do you want someone who's really gonna maximize the ROI you're getting on your marketing expense. So that's, that's the line in the saying you should draw, you should be able to three X your money. It takes some time to get there. You gotta be patient, but you gotta be able to get there. So that's Mr. Biz tip of the week and all you marketers and marketing agency people out there make, just send all your complaints to Rob. He'll take care of him. <Laugh> all right. So again, this week we're talking with Rob Kessler, he is the co-founder and inventor of the Million Dollar Collar, which you can find at milliondollarcollar.com. So Rob, talk to me about you know, the, the Genesis of million dollar collar. There had to be some moment or a culmination of a moment that you're like, I gotta do something about this

(12:07):

Biggest day of my life, right there, standing on the beach in Jamaica, in front of my bride, brand new freshly pressed expressed one MX dress shirt. You know, it was beach wedding shoes off toes in the sand pants rolled casual. I hate ties. But you could see my undershirt. It was crumbled. I was just adjusting it constantly. I came home from Jamaica. I looked at my wedding photos. I'm like, dude, this is, this is a disaster. And my shirt looks terrible on the biggest day of my life. And so I cut open a shirt, I shoved a piece of cardboard down the front, showed my new bride. And she was like, oh my God, I get what you've been complaining about all this years. You know, we'd go out to the, to the bars or whatever, you know, and she'd be dressed and I'm still in there ironing trying to like get the shirt to like sit right.

(12:48):

One would be down. One would be up. And, and I just hated that when it was asymmetrical. So I started with cardboard. It took three years to develop the material that is Million Dollar Collar. It looks insanely simple, but the material is high heat resistant to almost 700 degrees. It's flexible. It's super lightweight. It's soft enough to be sewn through. And it goes in between the layers of the packet. So picture a collar, stay for your dress shirt. It's at nine inches long and it goes down the front where the buttons and the holes are. So you can wear a shirt without a tie confidently. It'll sit great. You know, if you've ever put on a jacket or a sports coat that that lapel just eats up your collar and you're constantly tugging on it, you'll never have to do that again. It looks great all day, all night long. And once it's installed, once it lasted like for your shirt.

(13:36):

Well, here's the thing, Rob. So what I was impressed when I went out to your website and I was looking is one of the things I was initially concerned with is I'm like, is this like a temporary thing? Do you put it in? You gotta pull it out, like call like normal call stays. Right? You gotta pull it in, put it out. And that's not the case.

(13:54):

No. I mean, we're guys, we're idiots. We always forget stuff and we're always rushing around throwing stuff on last second. And actually what, what turns out if you really look at a dress shirt, if I put it, so it was a temporary or just stuck on, you'd see it on this side. You can see it on this side, you know, in the nineties, in when I was in high school and they came out with clear bra straps, like those were the nastiest looking things after a couple watches, cuz clear just doesn't work. So fortunately every single shirt's made exactly the same. There's always two layers in the packet where the buttons of the holes are. There's always two layers in the collar band, a tailor opens up a couple stitches, slides it in tos back together. You don't even need that much sewing experience. You can see my sewing machine right here. My mom taught me how to sew. I've upgraded over a thousand shirts myself. It takes five minutes to do once. You know how to sew. It's insanely simple. Every order comes with the instructions. And once it's in, just forget about it, man. It's in there and it last forever.

(14:48):

Well literally you wanna talk about simple the video that's actually you demonstrating how to do it. It's it's like the, video's like two minutes and 15 seconds or something like that. Insanely short and you, it's not like it's, you're speeding through it. I mean, it's, it's a simple process that even a dude could do. <Laugh>

(15:06):

I talked to a lot of tailors and they're like, you only putting a button on is easier than this. It's when you first see it, you think, oh my God, I, this is so complicated. But once you understand how a shirt is constructed and again, they're all made exactly the same, open up a couple stitches, slide it in. So that straight line back together, I mean the hardest part's matching the thread and so on a straight line, once you do that, it's in and it's done just is set it and forget it.

(15:31):

Well, the other thing I was impressed by when I was out on your website is that as you mentioned, it's for the life of the shirt, so you can, you can put it in a washing machine, you can dry clean it, you can iron it. How long did it take you to develop the material, to be able to withstand all that?

(15:47):

So I, I, you know, I kept testing stuff around the house. I took a milk carton and mini blinds and we had these flexible cutting boards. So I started with all those they'd wash and dry great they'd iron. I mean iron's only 200 degrees and then I'd send it to a dry cleaner. It would melt to the shirt. So after ruining about a hundred of my friends, you know, old shirts and things and we, we finally got this material figured out it all in was about almost three years to get that right. The material is a hundred percent made in America. I've got a dye cutter that, you know, I get the material made. It's dye cut out like a hundred percent made in America. So it's super cool that it's all made locally. I always like if I'm gonna have a manufacturer or a partner like that, that I've got a place that I can easily get to and go knock on the door. If I got a bang heads, cause it's the something's not going. Right. So I always like having stuff locally if I can.

(16:37):

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Well, the whole collar thing drives me nuts. And we talked about that before the show and I was telling, I was sharing with Rob is like this shirt. I actually really like this shirt, but I don't wear it nearly as often as I, I would, if it wasn't for this Dan collar. So I will definitely be going no, no lie. I'll be definitely going. Because the reason I wanted to mention that is it's not just for dress shirts, so you can get it for a polo shirt. Like this is just a regular polo shirt, right. It's got, you know, three buttons or whatever. So I like the fact that you've expanded into that as well, because I got man, I got, I don't know how many polo shirts that have crappy collars that drive me nuts and I don't wear 'em as much because of it.

(17:12):

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it was I, I was, I was hell bent and focused on the dress shirt side. So I really kind of got a little bit too much tunnel vision. And so a couple years ago, somebody just knocked me on the head at the right time was like, dude, why don't you have this for polos? And so I went back and I had to re-shoot everything and, and figure out the instructions. But you know, if it's the standard polo with single collar we've got specific instructions for that. If it's the nicer polos that actually have, you know, a packet and a collar band and all that you would do the normal million dollar collar installation, our polo pack is actually a DIY set. It comes with a seam ripper. So if you feel confident enough, you could pop a couple stitches, you know, you just slide it right in, cut it to length and you're good to go. So

(17:57):

Yeah. I mean, look, I, I'll touching on something you mentioned earlier and this I'm gonna, I'm gonna be a little, I'm gonna share probably a little too much that I probably shouldn't share, but I'm gonna do it anyway. <Laugh> when, when I, because the caller stuff drives me bonkers, especially in my corporate career, I worked for fortune 15 company. Back before I left, we had to wear ties to work every day. We got a little casual on Fridays, but you still had to wear collared shirt. And when I would see people with these crappy collars, like I'm not gonna lie. I'd be like, man, come on. Like, you can do better. Like come on. You know, it's almost like I was kind of judging people, right? Cause I used to drive me so nuts and it looks so bad.

(18:36):

Well, you visualize someone, you know, in the first five seconds you see them. And so if something's really way off, you know, it's gonna be an issue. So we actually have a lot of tie wears that. Love it because you get that gap between the first and second button. You could pop the tie off at, after go to happy hour and look great.

(18:51):

Yeah. Yeah. Well, I'll tell you and I we're heading to a break here, but I I've done it before where I've worn a shirt and the car was driving so nuts while I was out with my wife I'd button, the top button. And she's like, no, you, you look awful. Like you can't do that. <Laugh> come back after the break we continue talking with, Robbie's gonna tell us how to scale a startup.

(19:10):

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(19:40):

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(20:11):

Check out all three of Mr. Business best-selling books at mrbizbooks.com. Now, once again, here's Mr. Biz.

(20:20):

All right. Welcome back to the show. So by the way, I should mention guys, if you, if, if callers drive you nuts too, and you wanna try one of these bad boys or some of these bad boys Rob has been nice enough. So if you use the code MBR 15 MBR, Mr. Biz radio MBR 15, you can get 15% off. So thank you for that, Rob. And I will be using that <laugh>. I was actually trying to do it before we, we, we came on air. I was on my phone and I was playing around with it and I'm like, oh crap, I'm gonna be late. And I'm like, do I want 20? Do I want 10? Do I want, you know, I want, how many polos I'm trying to think in my head, how many polos do I need how many dress shirts but I'll definitely be doing that. So with your experience in being a rockstar entrepreneur that you you've been, what are some, some, some things that you've learned along the way that helped you be able to scale to the, to the Heights that you have with, with multiple companies?

(21:16):

You know, I love the saying riches are in the niches. I, I, I feel like that's really where I've gone. My screen printing business, I did the smaller orders. I mean, once you start growing and screen printing, these guys want 1,005 thousand, 10,000 shirts. I did one shirt order that was over 5,000, but everything else was small. If you have 25 shirts, you want that's, that was what we hit. Cause I could order those shirts on Tuesday, have 'em on Wednesday and be done printing 'em by Thursday and be paid. So I like that quick turnaround stuff. And obviously I got more per piece. I also love all inclusive pricing. I hate getting nickel and dime for stuff. So I figured out what it all was. So I've got a yacht charter, business screen printing business. We had office buildings, everything was all inclusive pricing.

(22:01):

I love that. I love that. Yeah. And I think I, man, I, I, I don't have not seen a study on it, but I gotta, I gotta think that that's something that just drives consumers crazy. I know it drives me crazy because a lot of times what you'll see is just what you're talking about. People advertise, especially printing screens screen printing shirts, or, you know, embroidering shirts, whatever it might be. And you go, man, I can get a under armor polo with my logo on it for $22. And then you go out, well, yeah, if you order, you know, 500 and oh wait the logo for us to set it up, that's 50 bucks and or 75 or a hundred or, and then all of a sudden you're like, okay, the price for shirt is not $22. Right.

(22:40):

<Laugh> yeah. Yeah. Hated that. Hated that. Hated it. Hated it. Yeah.

(22:44):

Yeah. Well, so, so, so what are some other things that you've used specifically to especially in the eCommerce side of things, right? So I'm, I'm sure you were in eCommerce with the, the shirt printing and embroidery and obviously Million Dollar Collar, your E eCommerce to the max. What are some of the, some of the lessons you've learned on that side of the businesses?

(23:03):

So for that, I am heavily invested in automations and up sales and cross sales. My, my chart, my yacht charter business is almost fully automated. I don't, I mean, I rarely talk to customers. They book online, I get the deposit follow up payment is sent out contract all that's automated. And then for Million Dollar Collar, you know, another tip that you see is if you're think you want 20 sets of my product order, the 10 pack, the Hey order another 10 pack right now for 35% off. And it's actually less expensive than a 20 pack. And then you can still get the discount code in there. So those upsells that's my challenge with the website versus Amazon is most customers leave my site with 2, 3, 4, 5 items. Amazon is always one cuz they don't have that upsell, cross sell stuff specific, you know, to me and my product and my store. So love that. I mean, I went from $14 average to $34 average once I got those cross sells in, in place.

(24:03):

Oh, oh wow. That's awesome. So if you don't mind me asking what, so what percentage of your business do you do e-commerce wise Amazon versus off your own site directly?

(24:12):

I'm about 75 or 80% Amazon actually. Okay. So we've the, the customers is there, the advertising dollars are stronger. Our return, as you said, early on our ROI is so much better on Amazon. It's about four or five X. So it just, it, it, I fought it for years, but at the end of the day, that's where the numbers are, then that's where to go.

(24:34):

Yeah. So, so along those lines, I'm guessing, you said you fought it for years. You probably were trying to figure out the, the social media stuff to drive people directly to your site because of the higher, higher average cart value. Did you, did you run into trouble with that or, or did you never, never quite figured it out and just said, heck with it. It's so good on Amazon. I'm just gonna kind of, I'm gonna, I'm gonna go with it.

(24:54):

<Laugh> because of the extra step with installing I don't know if we were in our own head, but we just could never, like, we all we'd get things going and then something would happen and it would kind of crash. And so we'd get the sales up and then something would happen. And you know, we've had so many agencies and so many people that said they knew what they were doing. They tried to plug and play our product with what's worked for them in the past. We had one company that did social media post. We spent $5,000 on, you know, affiliate posts in one month. And our sales went down from the month before that we spent zero on. So it's been a really, really, really weird ride. So as soon as we feel like we're hitting something, we lose it again. So we've got a great guy now and Amazon's just been always really consistent.

(25:36):

And so we stick with that. So we're, but we're actually making our own shirt coming up soon. I'm calling it the best shirt money can buy for under a hundred dollars and it's gonna be around 40. It's got our product inside. It's got a, a convertible cuff. So if you wanna wear cuff links, you can solid colors, white and black to star with wrinkle free. And those are gonna be, then I'll have a shirt that I can sell. That's like a done product that there's no extra step and you can just go in and buy a shirt that fits.

(26:05):

Yeah. Well, so if you don't mind, I, I know you're wearing a shirt that you said you just recently made a, a kind of a customized shirt. When, when are you guys gonna offer those or are you offering 'em already,

(26:16):

These are offered now. So talk about the niches. So instead of selling one shirt to one person, my company can digitally print any logo on fabric. You can see, we did this order for Citgo, perfect color match to their logos, and then the pieces are cut and sew and the shirt is assembled with your logo. So it's specific to your company with your logos, your shirt color it's a 50 piece minimum. We can do the shirts for like $65 a piece. But it is literally, I mean, they're super high quality from Turkey. They're amazing shirts. And instead of selling one shirt at a time, I'm selling 5,500, 5,000. So we're, we've got some really big, we're doing Acura and Cadillac and some massive, massive companies are, are looking at it. And it's pretty exciting, especially if you've got a great company and you're wearing dress shirts, but they just don't wanna, you know, wear a tie anymore. I'm working the angle of, look, you're gonna wear this shirt to work and go home and be like, my favorite shirt is my work shirt. I need to get this product in the rest of my closet. So I'm working the angle that way.

(27:16):

Well, and the other thing is, you know, this, this look, you know, this, this having a logo, even if it's embroidered, it's kind of played out. I mean, I know people have it all the time, but what I love about that is it's a new look, right? It's a different, it's a, you still have your logo, you still have branding, but it's a different look and much more sophisticated. And it again sets you apart, marketing branding wise of people who just have this, right. They, the typical thing you would see that's one of the things I, I really liked about when you, you, you mentioned it before the show,

(27:49):

It's super subtle. It's very, very classy. We call it the classy logoed shirt. You know, they just, they fit great. I don't have to have the perfect fit cuz it's still a work shirt, but I have extra small to four XL in slim and standards. So the smallest woman and the biggest dude can still wear this shirt. We can get you set up, takes about eight weeks to get the shirts in cuz they're literally made from scratch for you specifically. But they they're epic manage. I mean we've had jewelers and engineering companies and my cousin's a wealth management guy. I mean, if you got a great logo and you wanna do some branding, you got great customers, man, brand a shirt and hand it to, we did 'em for make a wish foundation and they use 'em for a fundraiser. So there's a lot of opportunity.

(28:33):

Yeah. And again, the, the sophistication in what it looks like compared to, you know, something like the typical thing, you would see you look at that shirt and you go that in my mind right away, I go, that's a custom shirt. Right. And so it's not just not that this is, I mean, this is technically custom. Right. But it's just a whole different feel. I feel like. So kudos to you for continuing to develop and evolve with that and then having the million dollar collar in it. Right. And so that's a extra bonus to the whole, whole shebang <laugh>

(29:02):

Yeah. You know, I'm, I'm always trying to find, look at it from the customer's angle and say, how can I make this as easy as possible for somebody to try my product and, and finding different avenues and different ways for them to, to get it on and try it. Cuz once you get million dollar collar in your shirt, once you, the rest of your closet has to have you, if you're gonna wear that shirt out, cause you're gonna wear it every freaking time. You can.

(29:21):

I bet. I bet. Well, Rob, thanks so much for coming on a show. Really appreciate it.

(29:26):

Absolutely. Man, it's been a blast. Thank you so much for having me.

(29:29):

Yeah, absolutely. Guys. Thanks for watching. Thanks for listening. Again. milliondollarcollar.com. Thanks for watching. Thanks for listening. Have a great weekend. And don't forget as always cash flow is king

(29:41):

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